Star Wars: The Old Republic

[Paladin]

Star Wars: The Old Republic MMO....

HOLY F-ING SHIT (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOvbv-LkK6w)

Granted, it's not gameplay footage, but damn.

[Kermit]

Finally, someone challenges Blizzard for awesome game trailers.

[Reaver]

Wow.

[Paladin]

Finally, someone challenges Blizzard for awesome game trailers.

It sounds like they are going to give them a serious challenge in the storytelling area as well. They are even planning to have all the game text 100% voice acted. Dialogue trees for many conversations will be included, like those in Mass Effect. What you choose may not affect the response you get, but it could nudge you a bit towards the light/dark side, or it could radically change the outcome of the conversation.

[Postal]

That SW the old republic trailer was amazing. That would have been great as part of a movie. Maybe they will have to make another Star Wars movie but set in the past.

[Kermit]

Yeah, and if they wait until Lucas is dead, it might actually be good.

[Creole Ned]

He doesn't have to be dead, just frozen in carbonite.

[Paladin]

1Up has a really nice hands-on with Star Wars: The Old Republic (http://www.1up.com/do/previewPage?cId=3174566&p=1)

IncGamers has one as well. Mostly the same info, since they saw the same demo, but a few tidbits of color taht the other article missed. Link (http://www.incgamers.com/Events/5/Previews/74/StarWarsTheOldRepublic/)

Incgamers also has some additional videos (links in the righthand column)... their download speed sucks, though.

[Creole Ned]

I haven't read much on TOR yet but has BioWare indicated what the endgame is supposed to be like? I'm really hoping they avoid the stale old raid mentality.

[Postal]

I think it is too early to know about the end game. I haven't heard anything on PvP yet.

[Paladin]

Other than the fact that PvP and raiding are included, they haven't said anything about either that I've heard. Knowing it is from Bioware, I suspect there will be a storyline endgame. After that,who knows. They'll certainly have something to keep people playing, and it will likely be PvP/raid based.

[Creole Ned]

In other words the same old thing.

"LF healer and dps for Jabba palace, PST."

[Bugzy]

Oh my god............Star Wars The Old Republic. Darth Bane invading Coruscant? This will be one awesome game!!!

[Postal]

Ned what would you have for an end game? SWG did a good job with crafting / city building as an end game. I like the new idea of dungeons that change layout but I don't think they would hold my interest long. Daily quests are cool but get boring too.

They do say each class has its own different story to play threw so doing each class might be fun.

Dang it I need this game to come out soon.

[Creole Ned]

I don't think a formal endgame is even necessary actually, I'd just like to see them steer away from the stale raid game. I don't think it's a good fit for this particular universe and the MMORPG genre has been around long enough that I think it could use a few new ideas instead of just reskinning EQ and WoW ad infinitum. By not having a formal endgame you also curtail the whole "rush to the level cap" mentality.

[Postal]

If they would come up with some new end game it would be nice but I don't know what that would be. I do think they need more casual end game content.

[Circuit]

I don't think a formal endgame is even necessary actually, I'd just like to see them steer away from the stale raid game. I don't think it's a good fit for this particular universe and the MMORPG genre has been around long enough that I think it could use a few new ideas instead of just reskinning EQ and WoW ad infinitum. By not having a formal endgame you also curtail the whole "rush to the level cap" mentality.

Then you get City of Heroes. Really, I don't know what the solution is. Hopefully someone will find it, but in a game that features leveling up and character progression, I'm not sure what that would be. WoW and games like it give you the option of doing raid content to take your character further instead of just stopping at the level cap. An alternative would be to give similar content that doesn't require large teams of people, but then you're pretty much just back to quests. In a highly story-based game, new content could keep you going for as long as the content lasts, but I haven't played any MMOs that do it well. I personally like WoW's method of endgame raiding, especially now that it's so much more accessible without enormous amounts of time. But I can certainly see why not everyone's interested in it.

[Postal]

You know I would almost like to see the end game be PvP but provide some non direct PvP interaction. For example have crafting play a big role in creating end game weapons, fixing walls and siege weapons. That way you can contribute to the PvP but don't have to get directly involved. Maybe something like use PvP to get materials to make great end game items but then have to go back to a guy who specialized in weapon crafting instead of PvP to make the powerful item.

I really liked some of the SWG ideas where you could make shops and markets even new towns. A lot of stuff was player made too like the weapons and building so you could craft instead of PvP fight. Even then I showed up for some of the bigger PvP fight when I felt like it.

I actually like PvP when 1) I'm looking to do it at that moment and 2) its in a big setting with many vs many not 1 vs 1.

[Creole Ned]

The problem with building an endgame around PvP is people generally suck and will do everything they can to short circuit design in an effort to min-max and win no matter what the effects may have on the experience for the "average" player. Enemies will conspire with each other to manipulate supply, one side will let the other win to get a particular trinket or piece of loot. In a way it would be similar to EVE and you could argue, "Hey, if it works in EVE, why not in another game?" But the entirety of EVE is built around this style of play, not just the endgame.

Really, unless PvP is the focus of the game, I think developers are better off not wasting their time and resources on it.

I'm expecting BioWare to assiduously avoid doing anything with their design that is anything like SWG. TOR won't be a sandbox, it'll be an RPG that someone familiar with WoW can jump into. Crafting will be a sideline, player housing and towns likely won't be in at all.

Yes, I am being a tad cynical with regard to this game. Okay, maybe a little more than a tad! :o

[Paladin]

MMO Gamer (http://www.mmogamer.com/06/11/2009/a-new-hope-for-mmos) has a nice long post-E3 interview with James Ohlen, lead director on SWTOR and Daniel Erickson, lead writer. They touch on a lot of topics including the storytelling, endgame and combat. I'll hit the highlights for those who don't feel like reading:


Each class, for each faction, will have it's own complete storyline longer than a Knights of the Old Republic game
There will be zero repeated quest content for any class or faction, a Republic smuggler will play a completely different game from a Sith Empire smuggler, for example
Flashpoint moments, where dialogue or actions launch combat, are instanced... using an example from WoW: the confrontation with Onyxia in Stormwind Keep would be an example of a flashpoint... in SWTOR, the fight would switch to an instance so people not in the party/group would not be involved or see it
Actions taken during the game will have a lasting impact on the story you play, opening or closing off quest lines, or making later quests play out in different ways
There won't be quests to kill x wamp rats (yay)
Even though quests will be tailored to each class, you'll be able to group up with other people to quest
Endgame will be based around the "wars" in Star Wars. They don't explicitly state what that means, but they mention raids
There are plans to continue the game via expansions


So far, they've announced 3 classes: smuggler, trooper and bounty hunter. On the SWTOR web page, there are slots for 8 classes, grouped as 4 Republic and 4 Sith. However, this article makes it sound like each of the 8 classes will have both Republic and Sith storylines. Not sure what to make of that at this point.

Ned, any chance of splitting the SWTOR posts off into their own thread?

[Tai]

everyone will be a smuggler jedi :)

[Paladin]

Voiceover Trailer (http://www.swtor.com/news/article/20090717_002)

This new trailer offers the first real good look at the gameplay, as well as providing some insight into how the dialogue and mission branching will work. The gameplay footage is from a piece of a mission which was shown as a demo for the press at E3. The graphics aren't terrific yet, but are an improvement over KotoR 2.

[Postal]

I was impressed by what I saw in this trailer. They have more done then I thought.