Roguecraft

[BoX]

Here's some video of a rogue or something.
http://warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=6140

http://files.filefront.com/World_of_Roguecraft___episode_/;4078859;;/fileinfo.html

[jackrabbit]

If there wasn't a video, I'd never have believed it. Completely unreal.

Not only was the guy an excellent player, he was a hell of a filmaker.

I hope I never cross paths with Mute or Kishkumen on Arthas. Apparently he could PWN me with a sharp stick and underpants. :(

[Andri]

Since WoW is down, I watched this video a few more times out of boredom. And I am actually not that impressed. Given that I have no clue how to play a rogue, and that I have no clue what he is doing whenever you see that yellow bar filling up (I don't mean his energy bar but whatever "spell" he is casting in between strikes), here are some observations:

1) He mockingly points out when people use potions, but he uses the time his opponents are stunned all the time to heal himself with bandages. What's the difference?

2) Since he is a disgusting sneakydude, he always gets the first strike. Adding to that the stun, he is at a huge disadvantage. My priest's spells stun 80% of the time, but only for a short time, and if I don't get to strike first, I'll be down to less than 50% health by the time I even get the chance to stun something.

3) Same thing for a warrior. I need to charge to have the rage to immediately use one of my good melee hits. Being sneaked up on puts me in combat, which means that I cannot charge anymore. That, in turn, means that I have to get pommeled a good bit by the rogue to gain enough rage to hit him even with a low rage cost melee strike. To me, it simply seems that you are much more likely to attack other players as a rogue (thus gaining the first strike) where you have the advantage of sneaking up on enemies and vanish when things don't quite turn out the way you wanted. As a warrior, I can't take that cheapo way out of a fight, so I think twice before I attack somebody.

4) Has anyone noticed that even naked and with only a single worn dagger he still crits well over 1000? WTF! Even with almost my full Imperial gear set and some nasty weapons, I hardly ever crit for more than 800. I mean EVER. And I have a shitload of XP, so I can survive a lot. But what about a priest or mage?

5) He is mostly fighting other rogues. It seems that in a one-on-one match between two rogues, the one to strike first should naturally be the one to win. (Assuming equal skill.)

6) How do we know that he did not exclusively record the cases in which he won? There may be a million other cases in which he lost and that he is just not showing to us. I am so inept at playing my priest PvP that any lvl 50 can beat me. I am really not impressed by a lvl 60 rogue being able to kick my ass.

And as a final word: The thing I enjoyed most about that viedo was the Rammstein background music in the beginning. Do you have the slightest clue what they are singing? Here's a little flavor: That particular song ("Heirate mich" = Marry me) is about a guy who can't deal with the fact that his girlfriend is dead. So he digs her up every night in the graveyard and kisses her. But her "skin rips like paper", and "for a second time she's escaping him". Most of their songs are about mentally deranged guys killing women/girlfriends or their mother. Or scaring little children. They are morbid and provocative to a fault.

Um... did I mention that I think them the best German band in the past 15 years, and that I vastly enjoy the outrage they constantly cause in Germany? I made a disc of all my Rammstein favorites and listen to it every morning on my long commute. Definitely keeps me awake. :bg:

[BoX]

1) He mockingly points out when people use potions, but he uses the time his opponents are stunned all the time to heal himself with bandages. What's the difference?


Well bandages are more accepted, everyone has some sort of CC they can use to get a bandage off, if you rend him he can't bandage anyway.

2) Since he is a disgusting sneakydude, he always gets the first strike. Adding to that the stun, he is at a huge disadvantage. My priest's spells stun 80% of the time, but only for a short time, and if I don't get to strike first, I'll be down to less than 50% health by the time I even get the chance to stun something.

A warrior should be able to wtfpwn a naked rogue no matter who gets the first strike. Rogues tear through casters (except maybe a demo specced lock) accept it. :)

3) Same thing for a warrior. I need to charge to have the rage to immediately use one of my good melee hits. Being sneaked up on puts me in combat, which means that I cannot charge anymore. That, in turn, means that I have to get pommeled a good bit by the rogue to gain enough rage to hit him even with a low rage cost melee strike. To me, it simply seems that you are much more likely to attack other players as a rogue (thus gaining the first strike) where you have the advantage of sneaking up on enemies and vanish when things don't quite turn out the way you wanted. As a warrior, I can't take that cheapo way out of a fight, so I think twice before I attack somebody.

You have bloodrage, use it. :)

4) Has anyone noticed that even naked and with only a single worn dagger he still crits well over 1000? WTF! Even with almost my full Imperial gear set and some nasty weapons, I hardly ever crit for more than 800. I mean EVER. And I have a shitload of XP, so I can survive a lot. But what about a priest or mage?

That's basically the point of the video

6) How do we know that he did not exclusively record the cases in which he won? There may be a million other cases in which he lost and that he is just not showing to us. I am so inept at playing my priest PvP that any lvl 50 can beat me. I am really not impressed by a lvl 60 rogue being able to kick my ass.


You don't know, but some of the guys he is fighting are some pretty good players. I'm sure he didn't win every fight and like you said most of the fights were vs rogues anyway. It's scarey the damaged they do totally gimped while warriors are f'd if the have crap gear

[Kermit]

I only watched it once and that was last week, but that was the impression that I got. He wasn't trying to prove he rulez, he's trying to show that rogues are the least gear dependant class.

[FoeKilla]

As a warrior, I can't take that cheapo way out of a fight, so I think twice before I attack somebody.

never think - act! You take the time to think and you have lost the initiative.
Retaliation will kill just about any rogue. Hopefully you don't get jumped more than once per 30 minutes. But, if you attack on sight (don't look at level, don't look at what class they are - ATTACK!) it becomes harder for them to hit you first.


the preceding message brought to you by Myex

[Andri]

Hi Foe! Nice to hear from you! Why don't you play Myex some more? :bg:

Actually, I am not doing so poorly against rogues as I made it sound. True, I did not think of bloodrage because I have an aversion against anything that costs me health. (And there always seems to be one button too many to remember no matter what class I play.) But I do, of course, use retaliation against the sneakydudes, and seeing my overpower lit up all the time is also an open invitation to kick their butts. I find mages and hunters a lot harder to beat. (In fact, I have never been able to beat a mage who was not at least 5 lvls lower than me.)

BoX, a friend of mine plays a discipline/holy spec'ed priest, and she says she can beat any rogue any time. She just let's Shadowword Pain do the job while she keeps herself alive with shield, fort, renew and the occasional flash heal under focused casting. (She does not even use fear much since everybody with a trinket gets out of it anyway.) I have seen shadow priests being equally successful against rogues without using any other heals on themselves than vampiric embrace. So it seems to be untrue that casters have no chance to beat rogue ass. (I myself are, of course, way too inept to pull off anything comparable with my priest. But that's just me.)

Mainly, that video served to perpetuating my continued loathing of rogues. Them being able to crit so high without gear or decent weapons is just absurd. Has anyone tried how much damage they can do unarmed? I bet they still crit for 800 or some crap like that. And they are definitely the class that attacks you the most. Admittedly, there's more of them around than any other class, but them being able to hang around stealthed until the opportunity is convenient, or being able to corpse camp you without you knowing it, must make them more likely to jump you. Or have you ever seen packs of 3 lvl 25 mages hang around in the wetlands ganking? The only person I have seen attack even more ruthlessly and constantly than any rogue is... um... Myex. Hahaha, Foe, you definitely didn't waste time on thinking when you charged those 3 lvl 60 hordies with your lvl 38 char. :lol:

And I still don't see much of a difference between using a pot or a bandage. Bah!

[Tai]

Rammstein rocks. Du hast mich gefragt!

[Andri]

Ich habe Dich nicht gefragt, aber ich stimme zu. :D My favorite song is "Alter Mann".